tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post2004894432825367164..comments2023-07-03T07:26:04.780-04:00Comments on The Rejecter: Editorial DemandsThe Rejecterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09087643296072075641noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-30868285710823992402009-04-06T20:05:00.000-04:002009-04-06T20:05:00.000-04:00The situation described happened to me with an ine...<I>The situation described happened to me with an inexperienced agent. She knew, presumably, what was in my novel when she signed me up, but apparently thought she could get me to change practically every major aspect of it (or likely she hadn't read it as thoroughly in the first place as she should have). Rounds of revisions ensued, with latter ones asking for ever more mind-boggling changes, to wit: a new beginning, new ending, new time period, new climactic scene. She didn't want the book I had written at all; she wanted some vision of it that she thought would sell better.</I> -- Anon<BR/><BR/>What'll she demand next? <BR/>Bishie-sparkling Vampires?<BR/><BR/>Does "Editor" mean "I Wanna Write THIS Book, but I'm too lazy, so I'll just demand this author who just submitted do it for me"?<BR/><BR/>Or is this one of those "I'm An M.B.A. And..." situations JMS used to talk about re <I>Babylon-5</I> vs the Network Suits?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-9190850520572434352009-04-04T07:07:00.000-04:002009-04-04T07:07:00.000-04:00Gotta be impressed by anon 10:49's insight into th...Gotta be impressed by anon 10:49's insight into the thought processes of an editor they know nothing about.nonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00415222406280230021noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-48385405851981434782009-04-03T19:29:00.000-04:002009-04-03T19:29:00.000-04:00You really need to break up your paras a little. H...You really need to break up your paras a little. Hard to read.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-11660025003965016892009-03-30T14:29:00.000-04:002009-03-30T14:29:00.000-04:00All the writers sympathize with you. Sometimes I f...All the writers sympathize with you. Sometimes I feel like an abused spouse, the kind that stays with the abuser instead of fleeing in the night, self-respect intact. <BR/><BR/>The situation described happened to me with an inexperienced agent. She knew, presumably, what was in my novel when she signed me up, but apparently thought she could get me to change practically every major aspect of it (or likely she hadn't read it as thoroughly in the first place as she should have). Rounds of revisions ensued, with latter ones asking for ever more mind-boggling changes, to wit: a new beginning, new ending, new time period, new climactic scene. She didn't want the book I had written at all; she wanted some vision of it that she thought would sell better. I've been an editor myself and understand that writing IS revision, but the unprofessionalism of asking for so many fundamental changes so late in the day blindsided me. By the end, I felt no love at all, and believe me, I'm not the kind who asks for much. <BR/><BR/>My own mss. was sent out with 90% of the changes my agent wanted, though not one that would have made her very happy (she did the email equivalent of screaming at me for not caving on this). I am pretty sure it will perish for lack of enthusiastic representation. YAY! Years of my life wasted. <BR/><BR/>Better luck on your own project!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-23776577192794059152009-03-30T13:24:00.000-04:002009-03-30T13:24:00.000-04:00I sympathize. On a much smaller scale, I've had a...I sympathize. On a much smaller scale, I've had an editor ask for just a few words to be changed/added to a story. Sounds minor but those few words changed what I was trying to do, changed everything in my opinion. But I did it and the story was published. In the final analysis a) it's just a story, b) the changes weren't that catastrophic, and c) I got paid.Jeff Draperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11950686688288213875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-41185869474445518972009-03-30T09:05:00.000-04:002009-03-30T09:05:00.000-04:00rejecter-not so much the mortgage crisis, but i've...rejecter-not so much the mortgage crisis, but i've had an experience with a poorly-built house I bought 2 years ago, and that's the book i'm trying to sell. a handful of agents have looked at it, and 2 have told me that they've tried to, and can't, sell "my housing crisis" stories to publishers, because they don't want 'em. the logic is that the whole country experienced housing crap, therefore no one wants to read about it.ms s.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-45658233896076900342009-03-29T23:17:00.000-04:002009-03-29T23:17:00.000-04:00There is an element of physical possibilities to t...There is an element of physical possibilities to this problem, as well- It's not just the differences of vision, it's the need to rewrite the thing under a gun.<BR/><BR/>Best of luck which ever way you go, Ms. R.dirtycarriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09414721562876577708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-70629467987691084002009-03-29T21:24:00.000-04:002009-03-29T21:24:00.000-04:00That sounds very frustrating for you. I hope the ...That sounds very frustrating for you. I hope the editing goes well.writtenwyrddhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02280711822302493122noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-48146262775711973242009-03-29T19:15:00.000-04:002009-03-29T19:15:00.000-04:00GateKeeper -- (I'm Anon 10:49) :)My original respo...GateKeeper -- (I'm Anon 10:49) :)<BR/><BR/>My original response was not to call out all editors, but the very specific situation that Rejecter finds her/himself in.<BR/><BR/>This is your quote: "...so likely they're not asking for changes on a whim..."<BR/><BR/>I agree with you, but in this situation, the changes ARE being asked for on a whim. <BR/><BR/>I'm sure the editor is nice and polite and loves books as we all do. But in this case it feels like the author is being cheated -- she did her part, wrote the summary and then the book -- it was the agent that let the contract go forward without bothering to read the summary.<BR/><BR/>Who is going to pay for this? The author.<BR/><BR/>From my perspective, your comparisions to other writing carrers is a moot point. Novel writing is not journalism or screenwriting. Screenwriters ideas are often generated in-house and then they are assigned to write them: they often have 3-5 writers, one after the other, doing mutliple drafts of a script (not all of the writers are listed). Individual journalism pieces still have to express the attitudes and nature of the publication (a left or right leaning political bend). And the writer knows this going in. <BR/><BR/>Novel writing is purer than either of those two mediums, and completely different, because it is supposed to be the vision of one person -- the author (with, to a far lesser extent, additional clarity provided by agents or editors or your best friend that reads a draft).<BR/><BR/>When that one person, the author, presents his/her vision for the book, the editor signs off on it, and then, after the fact says, "Oh, yeah, I don't like this, change all of it," -- I'm sorry, but that is wrong.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-28031927626770687372009-03-29T18:34:00.000-04:002009-03-29T18:34:00.000-04:00I don't suppose there's any middle ground? Maybe ...I don't suppose there's any middle ground? Maybe put some dark humor in it? I realize that might not be possible, but I'm wondering if you truly have no choice but to walk away or cave in completely. After all, you say there was humor in the first half of the first book.<BR/><BR/>I have no idea what I would do in such a situation myself. I tend to think if I couldn't find a solution that pleases both the editor and myself, I would walk away. But then I think, "It's just a book. Would it kill me to do what the editor wants?"<BR/><BR/>I don't envy your situation. I hope your decision is one you can live with.Elissa Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10727748060605823895noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-88513831631978752222009-03-29T15:47:00.000-04:002009-03-29T15:47:00.000-04:00Reason number 134 why self-publishing isn't the wo...Reason number 134 why self-publishing isn't the worst way to go.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-15966272596475942362009-03-29T14:04:00.000-04:002009-03-29T14:04:00.000-04:00green ray,She said ultimately it was my decision, ...green ray,<BR/><BR/>She said ultimately it was my decision, to walk away or to stay with the editor, and she would support me either way.The Rejecterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09087643296072075641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-55588152177589177832009-03-29T12:09:00.000-04:002009-03-29T12:09:00.000-04:00This is a really good discussion, though very diff...This is a really good discussion, though very difficult for you, Rejecter. I don't know what I would do. What does your agent say?green raynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-32186680709411861502009-03-29T01:16:00.000-04:002009-03-29T01:16:00.000-04:00I agree with Gatekeeper, in that most of the time ...I agree with Gatekeeper, in that most of the time in publishing, the editor and the writer are on the same page in terms of the book - wanting it to succeed - but don't always see it the same way. Usually these differences can be sorted out, because hey, the editor must like the book, they bought it in the first place, but occasionally you hit a real tight situation (such as mine) where the visions really don't match but the contract has already been signed, then you're in trouble. My editor really does believe in my career, and is a nice person, but it was her responsibility to read the summary before or immediately after contract signing so that she knows what she's getting well before the book is delivered. I guess she was so overworked for six months that she assumed everything would be fine, no time to read a 3 page summary, but things didn't turn out that way.The Rejecterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09087643296072075641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-71715432274908951172009-03-29T01:06:00.000-04:002009-03-29T01:06:00.000-04:00I definitely feel for you and understand your frus...I definitely feel for you and understand your frustration. It sucks when someone can't see the forest for the trees has so much power over the outcome.<BR/><BR/>So I just want to be clear that the following isn't in response to your words (which are definitely within the bounds of fair complaint) but to those of Anon 10:49 (who, I felt, took it a step too far).<BR/><BR/>Why is it people consider publishing to be unlike any other business? Even the arts. Bestselling authors call the shots the same way big-name actors or models or artists do. Yes, your name is going on the book, but until that name is the thing that sells it rather than plot or premise or word-of-mouth, why should you get more accommodation than the editor whose 9-to-7-and-beyond job it is to know what's going to sell? Do editors get it wrong some of the time? Hell yeah. But their career is also on the line, and their company is taking all the monetary risk, so likely they're not asking for changes on a whim. It's a business, and they're going to do what they think is necessary to make money.<BR/><BR/>Frankly, as far as professional writing goes, book publishing gives more rights than most. I can't count the number of changes made to newspaper and magazine articles I've written that I didn't know about until I held the finished product; but that's what editors do, they edit, sometimes just to get the columns even. And screenwriters, well, it's not entirely unheard of for them to be barred from even visiting the set; they have next to zero say in whether or not the finished product will even resemble their work.<BR/><BR/>As for their ever being a day when editors are afraid to burn bridges with even midlist writers, I don't recommend anyone holds their breath. The well of author-hopefuls will never run dry, and lately has seemed to be growing exponentially. At least if my slush is any sign.Gate Keeperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03808775672995741281noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-44509266263117453612009-03-28T10:49:00.000-04:002009-03-28T10:49:00.000-04:00And therein lies the double standard of publishing...And therein lies the double standard of publishing. Writers are expected to accomadate editors who make odd/bizarre demands for rewrites, yet if a writer doesn't agree about the changes requested for THEIR OWN BOOK -- that THEIR name is going on, that THEY created, they have to cave or lose the contract all together. <BR/><BR/>The balance of power is simply not in a writer's favor, unless you are a bestseller. I long for the day when editors have to worry as much as writers do about not burning bridges. <BR/><BR/>I hope whatever decision you make gives you peace, and mostly I hope you are able to find an editor for your next books that is more in tune with your writing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-91514568912980472262009-03-28T09:11:00.000-04:002009-03-28T09:11:00.000-04:00Sorry for your troubles, but thanks for the raw lo...Sorry for your troubles, but thanks for the raw look at the publishing world.David Kazziehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11753721662077319561noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-68517717448713484902009-03-28T09:02:00.000-04:002009-03-28T09:02:00.000-04:00Situations like this one are why an author needs a...Situations like this one are why an author needs an agent, huh? I'm sorry you have to go through this - it sounds like a difficult tightrope to walk. <BR/><BR/>(The question of how to develop the series is an interesting one; I can see arguments for both.)green_knighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16499896006012152260noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-8621525531930123482009-03-28T01:18:00.000-04:002009-03-28T01:18:00.000-04:00Here's another scenario. You have a close relatio...Here's another scenario. You have a close relationship with an editor, who no longer even asks for detailed outlines of future books.<BR/><BR/>Then this editor leaves the house and you are assigned to a new editor. And the new editor doesn't get it. <BR/><BR/>It happened to me.Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03743825684303825072noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-809390157778709282009-03-27T23:24:00.000-04:002009-03-27T23:24:00.000-04:00This is not a minor change we're talking about but...This is not a minor change we're talking about but the writing of a completely new book. Do you make the changes so you can be published or do you take the high ground, not compromise your original story? This is especially difficult because they've already published your first book. Is it possible to continue the series with another publisher? Otherwise, I guess you have to see how changing the book makes you feel. It's quite possible the editor has a good idea.TheWriterStuffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11204978205187305759noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-47397437064261818312009-03-27T21:13:00.000-04:002009-03-27T21:13:00.000-04:00Ouch! Sorry to hear you have to deal with that. ...Ouch! Sorry to hear you have to deal with that. Hope something will work out for you. And thanks for passing on the info. Good things to look for in the future.JC Falorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12752042179391838494noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-59092028889183653872009-03-27T21:02:00.000-04:002009-03-27T21:02:00.000-04:00Wow that does sound horrible. So she wants you to ...Wow that does sound horrible. So she wants you to write the book for what her vision of it is? Like a reader with high expectations for the next book in the series? They know what they want to happen if that doesn't then they don't like the book. <BR/><BR/>Sorry you have to go through that. Someday I'll be working with editors. Then I'll think back on this.Rachaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11918987890132222901noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-74472815028861430452009-03-27T17:55:00.000-04:002009-03-27T17:55:00.000-04:00I don't to get into specifics for anonymity reason...I don't to get into specifics for anonymity reasons (and to not insult my editor publicly) but basically, the editor expected nothing but laughs like the first half of the first book, ignoring the trend towards darker material in the end of book 1 and all of book 2, and told me to take out all of the dramatic scenes and make them into humorous situations. So we have dueling opinions on the tone of the series, and ultimately, she wins or I don't get published.The Rejecterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09087643296072075641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-35623128.post-886042601473509162009-03-27T17:29:00.000-04:002009-03-27T17:29:00.000-04:00I'm so sorry, that sounds horrible.Why is the edit...I'm so sorry, that sounds horrible.<BR/><BR/>Why is the editor forcing these particular plot changes? In what way do you think they detract from the book? <BR/><BR/>Does it seem like the editor doesn't "get" the book (maybe because s/he hasn't spent enough time on it?), and the changes come from misunderstanding? Do you think s/he's requiring these changes because the editor has a hole on his/her list that s/he was hoping your book could fill- before s/he realized what kind of book you'd actually written?Sashahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17371894965848820820noreply@blogger.com